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#1 02.Oct.18 19:35:04

ianely
Member

Permission to access fields

As part of my interest in local history, I am keen to obtain permission for occasional access on to privately owned fields (ie farms) to use my metal detector.

Can anybody help me obtain such permissions ?

I have one permission already on a farm adjacent to Tandle Hill Park and have found a couple of items of interest including a musket ball that is consistent with those used in the English Civil War in the 1640’s.

I dont expect to find items of significant value, but hopefully things of local historic interest ... as such i will post pictures of any interestng ‘finds’ for those who might be interested.

Any help will be greatly appreciated

Thanks ... ianely


Ian T

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#2 02.Oct.18 19:44:36

Erin
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Sorry I cannot be any help in gaining permission for access but I would be very interested in any finds you have.  I have always thought it must be fascinating when you have a find.  How do you start to put an age to whatever you dig up? Keep us posted ianely.

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#3 02.Oct.18 20:35:42

sg
Administrator

Re: Permission to access fields

It sounds obvious but isn't the best way just to ask the farmers?
You could speak with Phil or Colin Day from Days farm, Or the farm just down from the Puckersley. Or Kenyons at the end of Oozewood Rd
Sounds fun though. Good luck!


[citation needed]

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#4 02.Oct.18 21:08:21

Rebel
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

You never know you might find a hoard   is that right ?    Have you  just started ?.


I was in the House when the house burned down !.

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#5 02.Oct.18 22:49:00

Barleycorn
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Can I ask, will you be logging your finds with the PAS scheme?
You should contact the FLO and send images, co-ordinates and so on.

Please do - finders keepers 99% of things, but the location and context are vital bits of info - even for seemingly mundane items that in themselves have little if any worth.  Distribution and deposition are part of a wider story in most cases.

Please go via the local FLO - the golden rule is let them decide what is/isn't notable or important.

Also, you will find it more rewarding.

Last edited by Barleycorn (02.Oct.18 22:49:40)


I went through ALL your posts, found nothing,

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#6 02.Oct.18 23:30:23

Woody
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Most of the land behind Tandle Hills used to be owned by Thornham Estates down to the Yew Tree and was managed by and Estate Agent,

I may be wrong but Heywood Hartley & Whipp springs to mind,

A friend of mine lived down there years ago and wanted to extend his garden I am sure that's who he contacted.

Its a start, tummenupp


I would if I could but I can't,

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#7 03.Oct.18 16:30:24

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Barelycorn, what is the PAS scheme and flo ?
Thanks ... ianely


Ian T

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#8 03.Oct.18 16:45:04

Erin
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Woody wrote:

Most of the land behind Tandle Hills used to be owned by Thornham Estates down to the Yew Tree and was managed by and Estate Agent,

I may be wrong but Heywood Hartley & Whipp springs to mind,

A friend of mine lived down there years ago and wanted to extend his garden I am sure that's who he contacted.

Its a start, tummenupp


Heywood, Hartley & Whipp, that's a blast from the past, are they still in business, Woody??

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#9 03.Oct.18 17:01:50

Rebel
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

When they build all over back of Tangs  ,that big council estate  the diggers will unearth all sorts .


I was in the House when the house burned down !.

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#10 03.Oct.18 19:44:38

Woody
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Erin wrote:
Woody wrote:

Most of the land behind Tandle Hills used to be owned by Thornham Estates down to the Yew Tree and was managed by and Estate Agent,

I may be wrong but Heywood Hartley & Whipp springs to mind,

A friend of mine lived down there years ago and wanted to extend his garden I am sure that's who he contacted.

Its a start, tummenupp




Heywood, Hartley & Whipp, that's a blast from the past, are they still in business, Woody??



Don't really know, But the lad who owned the three storey house at the side of the Yew Tree years ago,

Bought all the land at the back of the houses that front onto the main Rochdale Road and up to the end of the Pub car park,

HWP came round in an Authoritive manner we own that land but the lad had done his home work they owned the land but not the access at the front,

So they had no way off accessing it they came to some agreement,

Hence why you have to go round the back to get to the bungalows built there he sold a section of his garden behind the three storey house off for the access road and a financial consideration,  wink


I would if I could but I can't,

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#11 04.Oct.18 09:00:05

Barleycorn
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

ianely wrote:

Barelycorn, what is the PAS scheme and flo ?
Thanks ... ianely

Portable Antiquities Scheme.

It is the system for logging your finds, so the importance and (in some cases)  value can be understood.

Overseen by the British Museum, it exists so that knowledge isn't lost - but in many respects, it works as a free information service that will correctly identify and understand your finds.

https://finds.org.uk/

Please use it.   Ownership and resale are not impacted by the scheme, but it is very important things become part of the regional and national record - only then do patterns of distribution emerge, in many cases.

Also a great source of guidance for how to correctly record what /where/when you find things.  Quite aside from making your own contribution to the heritage record, you will also get more accurate identifications ( and therefore valuations) than simply googling a similar image or asking a bloke who found a similar one in 2010!

Finds Liaison Officer
The person who oversees the PAS regionally.  Runs walk in sessions, training etc.

Locally, the regional FLO is based at Mcr Museum every few weeks.

Last edited by Barleycorn (04.Oct.18 15:30:44)


I went through ALL your posts, found nothing,

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#12 04.Oct.18 18:08:43

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

What finds have you had locally ?
Ianely


Ian T

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#13 04.Oct.18 18:18:48

Woody
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

ianely wrote:

What finds have you had locally ?
Ianely



From memory nothing of note,
But I do not think anyone has done much in Royton in the way of exploration,

Questions have been asked as to Could TandleHill Monument be a Burial Mound or an old Hill Fort/ Beacon Hill, ?


I would if I could but I can't,

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#14 04.Oct.18 18:22:30

Woody
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

ianely wrote:

As part of my interest in local history, I am keen to obtain permission for occasional access on to privately owned fields (ie farms) to use my metal detector.

Can anybody help me obtain such permissions ?

I have one permission already on a farm adjacent to Tandle Hill Park and have found a couple of items of interest including a musket ball that is consistent with those used in the English Civil War in the 1640’s.

I dont expect to find items of significant value, but hopefully things of local historic interest ... as such i will post pictures of any interestng ‘finds’ for those who might be interested.

Any help will be greatly appreciated

Thanks ... ianely



Years ago a Shaw man bought Swedish Timber from a local merchant while machining he hit something hard turned out to be a Musket Ball probably fired at a Wild Boar or Deer missed and hit a tree which had then grown over it,


I would if I could but I can't,

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#15 06.Oct.18 08:18:15

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

I understand that plenty of musket balls are found when metal detecting, but it’s still intriguing to think that there may well have been such skirmishes in our local fields back in the ECW of the 1640’s.
I don’t know if any Roman coins have ever been found locally, but that is my quest !
Ianely


Ian T

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#16 06.Oct.18 08:20:10

Erin
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Good luck in your quest ianely.   smile

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#17 06.Oct.18 13:20:42

Barleycorn
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Here are some links, and the contact details for the regional FLO - Ben Jones.

Ben Jones
Finds Liaison Officer - Cheshire, Greater Manchester & Merseyside
National Museums Liverpool, Department of Archaeology, Pier Head, Liverpool Waterfront, Liverpool, Merseyside, L3 1DG
Work T: + 44 (0) 151 4784259
E: Ben.Jones@liverpoolmuseums.org.uk

This is a great local hertitage blog https://archaeologyuos.wordpress.com/

Also - there is a day coming up in November that I am sure you would find interesting.

https://archaeologyuos.wordpress.com/20 … -day-2018/



Contact with regional bodies and, by association, other interested hobbyists looking at the past will enrich your enjoyment of your hobby.   I know many folks are reluctant to 'formalise' their hobby - but I can't really over emphasise how important it is that people don't simply dig up items and stick them in a drawer/on ebay...  Whilst 95% of finds a low/nominal value items, they are often part of larger assemblages and indications of activity that all add up to inform our understanding of the past - even very recent, post industrial items.


As an absolute mininum,. you should take some pics before you start digging (when and if you get a ping)  and log the co-ordinates in a log/notebook.

Last edited by Barleycorn (06.Oct.18 13:23:10)


I went through ALL your posts, found nothing,

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#18 06.Oct.18 20:56:01

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Went digging tonight ... loads of rusty iron I’m afraid ... plus a bit of copper tube and a ring-pull !
That Roman coin is out there somewhere in the field ... just waiting for me to find him.


Ian T

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#19 07.Oct.18 11:39:50

Rebel
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Theres a hoard out there somwhere  glasses


I was in the House when the house burned down !.

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#20 07.Oct.18 14:29:06

sg
Administrator

Re: Permission to access fields

It's crazy to think of Royton being under control of the Roman Empire


[citation needed]

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#21 07.Oct.18 16:34:14

ridge walker
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

i'm into this sort of thing, that young female proffessor who does srcheology stuff was onlast night and some roman history stuff, she drove to York to speak to the father and son who found the York hoard with metal detectors recently, they just went out together for something to do in a field they had permission for, they found the treasure in a pot, they think was buried by a saxon chief when the vikings came berserking, along with coins there were two silver bangles, she went to see the finds and one coin went back to King Athelrad which was part viking with Thors hammer and a saxon sword on the face, this was because they were passive to the locals and were more interested in settlement than fighting so that changed.

The vikings converted to christianity and one of the most wealthy gave the minster a great area of land he owned, as a token to the church he handed over a carved elephant tusk in the form of a war horn that was embelished with silver decoration and carvings of wild animals, she was shown this as this is how they recorded the gift in those days, its  very rarely shown to the public, the romans were centuries before but on Knowl Hill on Crompton Moor, the summit was known to have been a lookout post and its been searched, roman relics have been found there and are held in Saddleworth museum , it now has a police communication mast very close to this spot with a view back to Tandle Hill, no finds have ever been found here from this period, yet Thorp is viking and has a roman road passing through from Manchester following the river valleys.  Good luck ianely.

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#22 07.Oct.18 17:10:29

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Great info Ridge Walker ... thanks !
I recently read a brilliant local history book “The chronicles of Alda” ... which, going off memory, corroborates some of what you pointed out above.
Hopefully I will get permission to detect and dig on some of the land.
Ianely


Ian T

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#23 07.Oct.18 17:15:49

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

I asked the council for permission to detect around the edges of Tandle Hill Park ... but it was refused on some spurious grounds/reasons.
Very disappointing really ... I’m allowed to pursue many other hobbies in and around Tandle Hill Park ... but not metal detecting !
I plan to appeal their decision and keep pursuing it.
Ianely


Ian T

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#24 07.Oct.18 17:23:10

Barleycorn
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Another reason to contact and liaise with the local FLO is the contact with other hobbyists in the area - who may well have permissions you can share.


I went through ALL your posts, found nothing,

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#25 07.Oct.18 17:29:35

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Barleycorn ... i think i will contact the FLO per your advice ... simply to introduce myself and to ask advice on gaining or sharing permissions ... thanks for the great advice.
Ianely


Ian T

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#26 07.Oct.18 17:30:31

Rebel
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

I would be tempted to just do it anyway but then again i am a rough diamond .


I was in the House when the house burned down !.

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#27 07.Oct.18 18:28:03

ianely
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

It’s considered a heinous crime if caught without permission and carries custodial sentences akin to serious violent crime !

Don’t ask me why !

But certainly not worth getting a criminal record for.

A guy from Manchestercwas jailed for 16 months for detecting without permission then selling his finds on eBay !


Ian T

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#28 07.Oct.18 19:30:00

Barleycorn
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

ianely wrote:

Barleycorn ... i think i will contact the FLO per your advice ... simply to introduce myself and to ask advice on gaining or sharing permissions ... thanks for the great advice.
Ianely


smile smile smile

Good to hear.  I'm sure it will help you.


I went through ALL your posts, found nothing,

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#29 07.Oct.18 19:38:23

Rebel
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

Disregard my outlaw post  i dont want to be responsible for an Eroytoner being imprisoned .


I was in the House when the house burned down !.

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#30 08.Oct.18 07:50:20

ridge walker
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

I think the problem was the digging, they never filled the holes in, when you see them out searching beaches they have little spades with a small head, smaller than a border spade, but no rake so i can believe they dont reinstate the surface, if it was me it would be levelled and re-sown with grass seed and any footprints brushed out.

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#31 08.Oct.18 16:55:58

nola
Member

Re: Permission to access fields

ianely wrote:

It’s considered a heinous crime if caught without permission and carries custodial sentences akin to serious violent crime !

Don’t ask me why !

But certainly not worth getting a criminal record for.

A guy from Manchestercwas jailed for 16 months for detecting without permission then selling his finds on eBay !

yikes


Really called Janet (and still confused)

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